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Author Topic: You Ohio folks piss me off.  (Read 4201 times)

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IPrayForTang

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #15 on: November 03, 2004, 05:42:01 PM »

Quote from: "cuddlyevil"
the only reason people are bitching about us is because we were the last to go red. They can f*ck off

Just quoting for emphasis.
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Bronzetree

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #16 on: November 03, 2004, 10:46:12 PM »

Quote from: "cuddlyevil"
Y'know what? I don't really see why Ohio has to be blamed for the way things turned out. Seriously. The blame is spread evenly across statelines imho. We could've done a lot more to advance the cause, but that is true of every Kerry (or third party candidate) supporter out there, so frankly they can piss off. I'm *gasp* happy to be in Ohio, at least for now. So I refuse to say I'm ashamed to live here, we're not the only state that could've gone for Kerry and didn't, the only reason people are bitching about us is because we were the last to go red. They can f*ck off, I'm going to hide for a few days and then try to find other ways to have an impact (aside from voting) on the next election.


Motherfuckin' word. AMERICA is to blame for this, not Ohio. Bush won the popular vote by more than 3 million votes. The margin in Ohio is only a part of that.

I hate that Bush got re-elected, too, but had we a Democratic candidate who didn't focus so strongly on his limited time in the service for so long, and maybe came out strong and showed the world what a buffoon Bush is, we might not be having this conversation. As it is, Bush won - fair and square - and that's that. We have him for four more years, so we have no choice but to deal.
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rva

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #17 on: November 03, 2004, 11:25:56 PM »

I'm kinda glad you guys are seeing it as a lukewarm candidate losing.

'cause in Virginia I'm fairly certain the Dems could have run John F. Kennedy and he'd have lost.  In fact he'd probably have lost worse than Kerry just because he represents "liberalness."  

It's like you guys just need another shuffle the line up a bit while over here we're looking to see how we can stockpile ten years worth of first round draft picks.
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Hell Toupee

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #18 on: November 03, 2004, 11:34:37 PM »

Quote from: "rva"
It's like you guys just need another shuffle the line up a bit while over here we're looking to see how we can stockpile ten years worth of first round draft picks.


Speaking of draft picks, I now know why Hamilton county voted for Bush...

We support lovable losers.

Losing is in this city equates to staying the course, and no one stays the course better than Cincy. Ask Mark Twain.

-ct
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Jonathan

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #19 on: November 04, 2004, 12:52:11 AM »

Quote from: "rva"
Don't blame me, I delivered MY district.

Richmond:

Kerry  49,731 70%
Bush   20,606 29%
Badnarik 324 1%
Peroutka  108 0%

Wish I could say the same, but not even John Edwards's home county voted for him and Kerry.

In fact, I think he couldn't even carry his own precinct, if I'm reading this table correctly.
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rva

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #20 on: November 04, 2004, 02:02:46 AM »

Yeah, Edwards was kind of a ridiculous choice.  There was no way Kerry could win the South and it was foolish of him to try.  His best shot would have been Virginia but even then you're looking to Northern Virginia which prety much thinks the rest of the state and the South area bunch of country bumpkins.

Bottom line is Bush had 100+ electoral votes without lifiting a finger.  NY and CA are left leaning, but also powerful enough that they will make you kiss some ass so it saps your campaign.  To me, what is most important is that Democrats regroup and are honest about the situation.

It was an pure ass-whuppin'.  The blame isn't solely Kerry's, Ohio's, or the Southern/bible belt voting bloc.  They lost every way possible.  Situation isn't hopeless but you need to quit looking for scapegoats and quick fixes and do it right.
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Juliana

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #21 on: November 04, 2004, 08:08:35 AM »

awww, I love John Edwards.  

That aside though, my mom had the same complaint about Kerry always seeming to be talking about his service record.  I don't think it's something he necessarily wanted to focus on though.  Those crazy Swift Boat Vets for lies...I mean truth hit so hard and so fast that it left him scrambling.  Bush, Cheney & Co also kept it up, which is funny, since neither of them served at all.  It's just weird how that worked out, but I honestly do think that if he had his druthers, Kerry wouldn't have focused on it nearly  as much as they forced him to.  

I said in the other thread that I wasn't ashamed or embarassed, and that still holds, but I am disapointed.  Deeply disapointed.  I don't know why I was so sure Kerry would win, but I was.  I really was.  I mean, I knew there was a chance that Bush would win, but I guess I was just optimistic and hoped for the best.

I talked to my grandma (HARDCORE dem) in Toledo yesterday, and she was saying how she and her pal Helen watched the concession speech and just cried.  We just talked about the senate, house and white house being all republican, and how we didn't understand the Florida absentee ballots that were supposed to take days,  and how we don't understand why middle class, especially lower middle class and rural America vote Republican.
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Butter

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #22 on: November 04, 2004, 08:20:25 AM »

Quote from: "Juliana"
how we don't understand why middle class, especially lower middle class and rural America vote Republican.


C'mon now.  You know why.  You very smart gal.

And I don't know how others can say Kerry got his ass whipped when the margin of victory for Bush is less than 40 electoral votes, and less than 500,000 votes across 2 states.  That's close.  One of the closest elections in history.
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Jonathan

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #23 on: November 04, 2004, 10:29:46 AM »

Quote from: "rva"
Yeah, Edwards was kind of a ridiculous choice.

Actually, that wasn't what I was implying at all.

If Edwards was chosen solely to deliver the South, then yes, it was a pointless exercise because people don't vote for vice president. But, if Edwards was chosen in order to give him some national campaign experience for a run in '08, then it was worth it.

John Edwards is a viable Democratic presidential candidate for two big reasons: he's photogenic, and he's Southern. Ever since the shift of the "Solid South" from blue to red, these have been absolutely essential qualities for a Dem candidate to have in order to be successful.

There's a third quality that he lacks, and that probably will doom him anyway...a lack of executive branch experience. Governors and vice presidents (and generals) beat senators every time. The one exception is Kennedy over Nixon, but, come on! (Besides, Kennedy's dad bought him that election :)) I don't even know why senators even bother running for president.
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Dan

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #24 on: November 04, 2004, 10:40:00 AM »

Quote from: "Jonathan"
Quote from: "rva"
There's a third quality that he lacks, and that probably will doom him anyway...a lack of executive branch experience. Governors and vice presidents (and generals) beat senators every time. The one exception is Kennedy over Nixon, but, come on! (Besides, Kennedy's dad bought him that election :)) I don't even know why senators even bother running for president.

I've never even thought about this before.  Is there a reason for this?  What's the history behind it?  Why hasn't this been more in the forefront if it's true (I mean, how many times did I hear the stat about Ohio voting for the winner since 1964 or the Redskin's last home game before the election)?
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Bronzetree

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #25 on: November 04, 2004, 11:14:32 AM »

The Electoral College simply needs to go away. It makes no sense to me. Had Kerry won Ohio by a slim margin, and by default the election, he'd have still been down close to 3 million popular votes, but been President anyway. As much as I wanted Bush to lose, it's simply unfair to discount that margin. That's not even remotely close. This is the same reason people were pissed about the '00 election. Gore won the popular vote, but Bush got the Electorals necessary for a win.

Lame.
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Kwyjibo

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #26 on: November 04, 2004, 11:29:21 AM »

As Tom Brokaw said on Letterman last night, the people who would be the ones to change the Electoral College are people who were elected by it.  As you can guess, they're not in any hurry to do that.
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Jonathan

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #27 on: November 04, 2004, 11:33:36 AM »

Quote from: "mistergugi"

Quote from: "Jonathan"
There's a third quality that he lacks, and that probably will doom him anyway...a lack of executive branch experience. Governors and vice presidents (and generals) beat senators every time. The one exception is Kennedy over Nixon, but, come on! (Besides, Kennedy's dad bought him that election ) I don't even know why senators even bother running for president.

I've never even thought about this before. Is there a reason for this? What's the history behind it? Why hasn't this been more in the forefront if it's true (I mean, how many times did I hear the stat about Ohio voting for the winner since 1964 or the Redskin's last home game before the election)?

My thinking, and what I've read and learned about it, is that voters tend to favor candidates with previous leadership experience, since being an executive is quite a different animal than being a legislator.

Here's the results of the presidential elections in the 20th and 21st century. Draw your own conclusions:

2004 - Pres. George W. Bush def. Sen. John Kerry
2000 - Gov. George W. Bush def. VP Al Gore
1996 - Pres. Bill Clinton def. Sen. Bob Dole
1992 - Gov. Bill Clinton def. Pres. George Bush
1988 - VP George Bush def. Gov. Michael Dukakis
1984 - Pres. Ronald Reagan def. former VP Walter Mondale
1980 - Former Gov. Ronald Reagan def. Pres. Jimmy Carter
1976 - Gov. Jimmy Carter def. Pres. Gerald Ford
1972 - Pres. Richard Nixon def. Sen. George McGovern
1968 - Former VP Richard Nixon def. VP Hubert Humphrey
1964 - Pres. Lyndon Johnson def. Sen. Barry Goldwater
1960 - Sen. John F. Kennedy def. VP Richard Nixon
1956 - Pres. Dwight Eisenhower def. Gov. Adlai Stevenson
1952 - Gen. Dwight Eisenhower def. Gov. Adlai Stevenson
1948 - Pres. Harry Truman def. Gov. Thomas Dewey
1944 - Pres. Franklin D. Roosevelt def. Gov. Thomas Dewey
1940 - Pres. Franklin D. Roosevelt def. Wendell Wilkie (who never held elective office)
1936 - Pres. Franklin D. Roosevelt def. Gov. Alf Landon
1932 - Gov. Franklin D. Roosevelt def. Pres. Herbert Hoover
1928 - Commerce Sec. Herbert Hoover def. Gov. Alfred E. Smith
1924 - Pres. Calvin Coolidge def. Amb. John Davis
1920 - Sen. Warren G. Harding def. Gov. James Cox
1916 - Pres. Woodrow Wilson def. Judge Charles Hughes
1912 - Gov. Woodrow Wilson def. Pres. William Howard Taft and Former Pres. Theodore Roosevelt
1908 - Former Gov. William Howard Taft def. Rep. William Jennings Bryan
1904 - Pres. Theodore Roosevelt def. Judge Alton Parker
1900 - Pres. William McKinley def. Rep. William Jennings Bryan

Most elections tended to be two people with executive/leadership experience going against each other. However, when an executive faced a non-executive, the executive usually won. The exceptions were 1920 (which gave rise to the incredibly corrupt Harding administration) and 1960.

OK, I'll stop poli-sci geeking out now.
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Nate

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #28 on: November 04, 2004, 04:11:35 PM »

I think we should have a new logo that identifies us as citizens of the country known as the USA but not under Bush. the blue state nation or something. The ex-pats who won't ex. The re-pats? We can use it to I.D. each other and to torch the homes of the nonbelievers. ;)
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Nate

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You Ohio folks piss me off.
« Reply #29 on: November 04, 2004, 04:26:52 PM »

OK, here's an idea using the jackalope as our official state animal.  What y'all think?
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